EEYEN wrote:

Burdur Obama wrote:

Señor Drächen wrote:

And Burdur has CJ1YD on his list

Honestly, the only 2 I'd still 100% keep are Wilkerson & Richardson. The rest are really a toss up but I might keep a few of the rest on my list anyway just cause there's almost no one else getting shit done consistently.

The five Jets I'd keep:

1. DT Muhammad Wilkerson
2. DT Sheldon Richardson
3. LT D'Brickashaw Ferguson
4. QB Geno Smith
5. WR Eric Decker OR SAF Calvin Pryor

Yall need some motherfucking talent on that team. That's a sad ass list after the first three. God damn.

There's no way I'm keeping Geno Smith unless I had to. I'd get an entire new offense and keep Decker as a starting piece to be WR2. I agree with the other 5 besides Geno. Would still consider Milliner to be #5 as a hopeful keeper tho.

How are you holding out for Milliner but not for Geno? Geno has been better than Milliner.

Milliner is a CB. Geno is a QB. That's the major difference.

There is no other use for Geno if he isn't a serviceable starter, and tbh there's just countless better options from game changers to game managers.

Milliner could be anywhere from our #1 to like a #4 backup depending on how he improves, and could actually contribute to the team in some way either way.

Man that nigga Ian still riding the Geno bandwagon

It's over

I tried, and was truly hopeful this season after considering his solid finish last year and what seemed like much more confidence and determination on his part. He needs help tbh but at the same time, he's just not good, nowhere near consistently as he needs to be anyway. I'm done with that bandwagon and not jumping back on at any point.

I will never say a QB sucks while he's dealing with Marty Moron calling plays and has Jeremy Kerley and Jeff Cumberland as starters. Yall don't even have a Stephen Davis like Sanchez had. Your team sucks, point blank. There isn't a team in the league with less. you've yet to prove anything other than your 2nd round pick won't miraculously make garbage good. Till he has an actual team around him, I'll trust my eval.

The Jags have less. We just have a young QB/WR prospects...and that's about it.

I think it's pretty comparable. If everyone were healthy I'd take Jacksonville's group by a bit.

Anyways, Bortles has five interceptions in three games so far with your garbage ass team. You bailing yet or does the team suck?

It's very hard to make any criticisms on Bortles this early in his career since he's playing behind the worst OLine in NFL history & no running game. He's made a lot of big plays so far tho. Hell, he may even be the best running threat on the team.

Drafted 3rd overall, somehow he has less expectations than Geno, drafted in the 2nd round.

Or more likely, people are more willing to conclude the Jags suck and Bortles can't work miracles than they are that the Jets suck and Geno just can't work miracles because of previous perceptions of those teams.

The thing I don't understand about the Jets is how do they have all that cap room & don't get better. W/ all of those WR's/CB's that were out there they only get Decker to be their #1?

I think the GM is sabotaging Rex Ryan. I just think Geno is a casualty. Didn't want the backlash of firing Rex after he went 8-8 with the last guy's garbage. Wants to his "own" coach in. Bet you money, once Rex is fired, they start spending again.

On the whole "working miracles" thing. I've seen Stafford look like a top five QB when we surrounded him with weapons in 2011, and I've seen Stafford look terrible when we started Kris Durham, a should-be-retired Nate Burleson, and a past-his-prime-but-was-never-that-good Brandon Pettigrew. Once you realize you don't have a hall of famer under center, either get the dude a great running game or surround him with weapons or he'll fail, period. Jets achieved when they gave a young Sanchez a great running game. Took a head-case-reject in CJnoK and a Saints committee back and thought "Geee golly wiz, this will work!"

Oh and the fact this is true is why QB wins are not a real statistic.

I think Idzik is trying to get Rex fired, too. The FO is basically forcing Rex to play guys he doesn't want to.

This nigga Burdur trashing the Geno bandwagon and he's wet on Vick.

Vick had arguably the best supporting cast in the league in Philly. Best O-Line in football, one of the best in the last two decades. prime Shady McCoy. Prime DeSean Jackson. Celek, Cooper, Maclin...

What did he do with it? In his last 16 starts he led the Eagles to a 5-11 record.
Completed 57.1% of his passes.
20 Total Touchdowns
13 Interceptions.
15 Fumbles.

Vick checked out mentally when the Eagles gave him that new contract. If he has a back-up job next year, the league fucked up. He's done.

Yes, if you compare them head-to-head with Geno's starts so far it'll look better, but you have to factor in the supporting cast.... The supporting cast that led Nick Foles to the greatest 10 game stretch in NFL history. Vick was compareable to Geno Smith NOW with that. And people still want Vick.

Even if you want to give up Geno Smith, and there are smart people that never really bought into the hype because of how high-and-low he gets, that's fine. But he IS better than Michael Vick, and for some reason he also has a more professional approach to preparing for games.

Señor Mexicano wrote:

This nigga Burdur trashing the Geno bandwagon and he's wet on Vick.

He also thought they were winning the division

^ I said that thinking the Pats would be pretty bad this year but then after looking at the schedules and stuff I figured the Pats would be good again and the Jets would finish with a wildcard...

As for Geno, he still doesn't make the throws he needs to make. Unless he's having one of his really solid games, which come very sporadically, he's missing receivers all over the place numerous times per game from 5 yards out to 20+ (both missing the throws and not seeing wide open guys at times). He creates turnovers at the most inopportune times, one of which this season completely shifted the momentum in their game with Green Bay and should've never even been thrown (deep to Sudfeld, not on target at all & he was covered pretty well anyway). We could've at least taken a FG there, instead we gave up a TD on the other end. There's countless examples that had me not on his bandwagon in the first place starting last season. I get the supporting cast is hella bad (I still like the RBC tbh, CJ just needs to start doing more) but Geno needs to make some more of the throws as well. A lot of his picks and incomplete passes look pretty downright awful going back to last season.

Also, it's still a better situation than Jacksonville both offensively and defensively. The Jags don't actually have a D. (only secondaries might be comparable) But anyway, offensively Jags have NO RB's and those receivers aren't going to make things happen unless Blackmon & Shorts were active at the same time, then they have enough receiving talent at least to say Bortles should be doing better this early in his career.

As for Vick, I think he's better than you guys are giving credit for and I just want a change in the offense at this point. We were getting blown out by SD so I wanted to see if he can start anything offensively. And I'd like to see him out there again tbh... this is going to be a wasted season regardless unless something happens NOW. Vick is explosive and can make the plays down field.

Burdur Obama wrote:

Also, it's still a better situation than Jacksonville both offensively and defensively. The Jags don't actually have a D. (only secondaries might be comparable) But anyway, offensively Jags have NO RB's and those receivers aren't going to make things happen unless Blackmon & Shorts were active at the same time, then they have enough receiving talent at least to say Bortles should be doing better this early in his career.

This is false. Jags' pass rush > Jets' Pass rush. We're the second best pass rushing team in this league. Where as Jets' run D > ours. Like Ian said, everywhere else is pretty even. Jets may be slightly better than us because of personnel

It's also tough to make a comparison & say Jets RB's > Jags RB's w/o an OLine. Jets have one, we don't. Ivory is ok & CJ1YD is just ass . And as far as WR's go, the Jets should've drafted some of these dudes. Even without Blackmon & Shorts, we have two rookies that have been faaaaaar more productive than any Jets WR so far lol.

Fair enough at the defense. But Jets RB's >>>>>> Jags RB's

Jets' OL has the talent from name value of guys like Ferguson & Mangold but as a group they're truly very inconsistent and Ivory/CJ have to make it happen on their own a lot of the time. It's something I'll defend Geno for as well, the OL has been under-performing since a season or two ago. At times anyway, maybe they're just outmatched by certain defenses when I think about it.

Anyway, as for your main point. Those rookie WR's are getting stat-padding production. No running game, and large amounts of targets when behind (practically always). They DO have the benefit of having a bunch of decent talent, unlike the Jets who fall flat in the bottom half of their depth chart. As far as talent goes... Decker's better than any of them and a case could be made for Kerley too while he's our #2 WR anyway. When Kerley's our #1 with Decker inactive THEN the Jags have the better receiving corps, by a decent amount.

And I'm just making an assumption here but pretty sure it's right when I think about the Jags' games this season... those WR's don't actually do much until the later half of games when defenses are just preventing big plays (or don't actually care much at all due to a blowout).

Burdur Obama wrote:

Anyway, as for your main point. Those rookie WR's are getting stat-padding production. No running game, and large amounts of targets when behind (practically always). They DO have the benefit of having a bunch of decent talent, unlike the Jets who fall flat in the bottom half of their depth chart.

This makes no sense. Stat padding production when we're always behind? Jets find themselves in the same postition every week & the lack of production at WR are the problem, Jacksonville does not have this problem. If this were the case, how do we get blown out by the Chargers the week before the Jets did & STILL manage 300 yards total offense while New York can't even get over 40? Why doesn't this stat-padding production apply to the Jets offense? Easy: you have no offense Give me a break.

Burdur Obama wrote:

As far as talent goes... Decker's better than any of them and a case could be made for Kerley too while he's our #2 WR anyway. When Kerley's our #1 with Decker inactive THEN the Jags have the better receiving corps, by a decent amount.

And I'm just making an assumption here but pretty sure it's right when I think about the Jags' games this season... those WR's don't actually do much until the later half of games when defenses are just preventing big plays (or don't actually care much at all due to a blowout).

Man, you got to actually watch the games before making assumptions. No one says the Jets > Jags WR's after the first 6 games. Kerley isn't even a WR 4 on most teams.

Ivory is the best RB out of both teams, but besides that, everyone else is equally as trash.

But don't sit here & act like the Jets & Jags have comparable WR talent. Only one WR from that team gets a game for us -- and that's Decker

Ivory and Gerhart are pretty comparable IMO and the fact Ivory is so shit in the pass game really relegates his impact.

List of offensive players on the Jets that would make the Lions roster:

1. D'Brickashaw Ferguson. Starter at LT. Reiff kicks in to LG.

2. Nick Mangold. Starter at C

3. Eric Decker. #3 WR. He'd get starter snaps but not be designated as a starter. Lombardi uses a base 12 personnel.

4. Geno Smith. #2 QB. Would take Orlovsky's spot as the field-back-up.

5. Breno Giacomini #4 OT. Can't play LT so he's behind Corey Hilliard. Is not activated unless a injury.

6. Chris Ivory #4 RB. Would not be activated for games because he is so shit in the passing game. Insurance for Joique or Reggie, while Theo stays active in his special teams role.

That is the full list. 2 Starters. 2 Game Day Reserves. 2 End of the Bench Guys.

Kerley gets absolutely no love on here. He's a legitimate WR3 on a good amount of NFL teams. The Jets are just forced to use him as a #2 or #1 at times, which is really just too much for him... mainly due to the garbage behind him on the depth chart.

I don't understand how you guys are trashing him yet saying guys like Allen Hurns and Robinson among many other decent-to-bad receivers are better. The Jets lack depth and a #1, but Decker & Kerley make them at least comparable / as good / better than the Jags' receivers. Those 2 can get it done with a good QB that can hit them in stride.

The Jags just have an abundance of very average talent with upside (considering with Blackmon out & Shorts being up/down, in/out) while the Jets have garbage at the bottom of their depth chart.

Also, Gerhart is decent with a good OL but still not on Ivory's level regardless. If you watch Ivory run, he looks like he's a top 10 RB most of the time. His inability to handle a big workload consistently and his ineffectiveness in the passing game bring him down a notch, but he's not comparable to Gerhart.

CJ is better than Denard, Storm, etc. Please no one say otherwise.