Let's say another Ted Turner situation arises, and everyone is available, aside from people currently on WWE contracts, CM Punk (Who is retired), and Del Rio and Mysterio until their non-compete clauses are done...

Is there enough talent in the indies/TNA/NJPW/AAA to support a REAL number two? Or would there have to be a long-evolution period where new stars are created over three to five years?

I don't think there's enough "Top Guys" at the moment. It's literally AJ and Kurt, maybe Aries, and Kurt's pretty much done.

You could do a lot with good booking. Look at ECW or Mid-South Wrestling.

TNA had some of the best talent in The World. But when you have Russo as your head of creative and put a garbage product on TV you're not going to do it.

There aren't enough established free agent names, no.

A company vying to be number two these days would need several things: Good creative, good talent (preferably one or two big names in there), a television deal, good publicity, and great production quality. If a company has all of those things (missing even one will cause a lot of people to dismiss them outright), then maybe they could become a number two company to WWE in a couple years.

Even then, WWE will farm most of the good talent like they do ROH, anyway.

Wrestling is a dying business. No.

Talent? Yes. NJPW already has more talent than the WWE. The problem's name value.

Señor Drächen wrote:

Wrestling is a dying business. No.

I wouldnt say wrestling is dying persay, it's simply not as interesting as it was 5-6 years ago though. I attribute that though to most of the fanbase simply watching WWE and nothing else, and people see that as wrestling as a whole

FinestJellyBeansRaw wrote:

Talent? Yes. NJPW already has more talent than the WWE. The problem's name value.

Ehh, there was a report the other day how people are looking to jump to NJPW, so the name value isnt an issue. It's how the product can be seen, that's more of a problem.

I agree that wrestling is a dying business. Which is why people that are happy TNA is dying are retarded.

I don't think wrestling is dying either, but I don't think you really have the talent to do what I'm saying. How many possible main event level talents as far as a USA audience goes are really out there?

In Japan you have AJ and Okada. I think Michael Elgin would have some chance depending on booking. I think Ricochet could have some chance depending on booking. But I don't really see the indies as being loaded with potential main event talent like it was just a few years ago. Then you're down to the hasbeens in Bill Goldberg, Scott Steiner, etc. and the four TNA guys that still have that in them: Bobby Roode, Austin Aries, Bobby Lashley, (If you can pry him away from Belator) and Kurt Angle. Other than that: John Morrison if you can convince him to quit acting. So I have 9 names, and that includes (imo) killing off TNA.

If you were to include Del Rio and Mysterio, maybe it's possible. But I don't know how much good it would do.

I dont think NJPW would be a challenge to WWE, because they are in Japan. It's like saying AAA is competition. Even though AAA has a huge Mexican following and they are enormous in Mexico, they don't attract a giant amount of American viewers. NJPW might one day be as big as WWE, but they can't be competition because it's in Japan.

NJPW in terms of their roster, production values etc is on the same level as WWE. Just because it doesnt have an American television show doesnt mean it isnt competing for viewers in Japan with the WWE. They want that Japanese market (which is why they signed KENTA and Devitt) and they have to go through New Japan to even take a third of that fanbase.

How is wrestling not a dying business when WWE is basically running a monopoly? And even their ratings blow.

Dead wrote:

NJPW in terms of their roster, production values etc is on the same level as WWE. Just because it doesnt have an American television show doesnt mean it isnt competing for viewers in Japan with the WWE. They want that Japanese market (which is why they signed KENTA and Devitt) and they have to go through New Japan to even take a third of that fanbase.

What relevance does any company in Japan have outside of it.

^ Thank you. That's why I didn't reply to it. Either he didn't read my comment at all or he is just pretending to ignore it.

Wrestling isn't dying, it will always be around in some form and I think WWE will be on TV for many many more years. but it could be at the point where wrestling will never reach the heights that it once did during the 90's or even during the 80's.

You said NJPW isnt competition to WWE. It is. Regardless if you want to acknowledge it or not.

It has nothing to do with how I feel about it at all, stop being a moron. I'm not shitting on NJPW or insulting it in any way at all. I compared it to AAA. It might be a huge wrestling company, but it's not legitimate competition because it's in Japan, just like AAA will never ever be legitimate competition because it's in Mexico.

Just because a company is from a place doesn't mean they can't have a presence in a market outside of that place. Do you really think WWE doesn't care about fans outside of the US, or that AAA has no interest in getting more American fans?

I agree with Razor. They're in partial competition but not really "competition." WWE sees Japan and Mexico as a "fringe market." They're trying to have a presence there but they don't want to be the main wrestling entity there. That's why they do very little touring of either place and mostly stick to the United States. WWE's main market is the USA. They have a strong presence in Europe and Canada. They have fringe markets in Japan and Mexico.

Whereas New Japan, for example, has a strong presence in Japan, but is trying to create a fringe market in the USA.

It's like... The EPL has created a fringe market in the USA. They do some matches here. The NFL has created a fringe market in the UK. They play some games there... But they're not in competition. They each have their market share carved out and the remaining demand is what's being targeted. ("But they're not the same sport?!?!" doesn't matter. NFL is in competition with MLB.)

WWE has no interest in touring Japan full time. New Japan has no interest in touring the USA full time. They have no natural competing television or PPVs. Thus, they're not in competition.

^^ fucking that. This guy gets it. When the WWE goes over to Japan, they are trying to pull some of the NJPW fanbase away from them. Why the fuck do you think they signed Devitt and had interest in Okada? Their presence in that country isnt as strong as it once was, and how do you gain some of that back? You sign 2 of the biggest names in that country. Same goes with AAA. AAA is getting an American television show in September, and WWE goes down there to give guys from AAA/CMLL tryouts so they can tap into the latino market as well. If NJPW and AAA werent competition, WWE wouldnt acknowledge their existence, let alone their talent's existence.

Ian wrote:

I agree with Razor. They're in partial competition but not really "competition." WWE sees Japan and Mexico as a "fringe market." They're trying to have a presence there but they don't want to be the main wrestling entity there. That's why they do very little touring of either place and mostly stick to the United States. WWE's main market is the USA. They have a strong presence in Europe and Canada. They have fringe markets in Japan and Mexico.

Whereas New Japan, for example, has a strong presence in Japan, but is trying to create a fringe market in the USA.

It's like... The EPL has created a fringe market in the USA. They do some matches here. The NFL has created a fringe market in the UK. They play some games there... But they're not in competition. They each have their market share carved out and the remaining demand is what's being targeted. ("But they're not the same sport?!?!" doesn't matter. NFL is in competition with MLB.)

WWE has no interest in touring Japan full time. New Japan has no interest in touring the USA full time. They have no natural competing television or PPVs. Thus, they're not in competition.

^ Fucking that. This guy gets it. Why is it so hard to have a working brain for some of you?

it's half and half with this. I mean I see Razor and Ian's point but Dead and Jelly Bean have point as well. All this is just looking from the outside of everything and we see in different views.

but I think for there to be a real number 2, it will take a lot of work and alot of companies might need to band together for there to be a real number 2. Just because there's isn't enough "Top Guys" at the moment. doesn't mean people can't become top guys.

When WWE tours Japan or Mexico, I don't believe they evaluate the product and say "what can we do to rise above NJPW or AAA?" WWE does its thing, sells their tickets, puts on a show, packs up and leaves. The ball doesn't stop rolling for NJPW or AAA or anyone else. As Ian noted with fringe markets, WWE certainly cares about those respective demographics, but only enough to maintain a presence in said markets rather than dominate the entire market. So I'd agree that WWE is not in competition with those promotions.

To the original topic, of course there are tons of talents available outside of WWE, but none big enough to make a splash against WWE. For there to be a formidable #2, major players from WWE would have to jump ship to even generate interest to stand out against the WWE juggernaut. But even then, we live in an age where we can pinpoint the moment Bully Ray steps out the door in TNA after his contract expires, so there'd be no shock factor to it like when Hall and Nash appeared on Nitro. I doubt we'll see another legitimate wrestling company pose a threat to WWE for a very long time.