I mean really Rolliins' record is like 1-12 for the last month.

If WWE was a real sport he would have been cut

He's the weakest booked champion since Bob Backlund. <_<

What's sad is they're probably going to wonder why Rollins isn't some huge star after he drops The WWE World Heavyweight Championship.

Edge didn't have the best win streak, plus anyway Rollins has lost most matches by DQ and tag team matches.

Fans are supposed to think he doesn't deserve the title, that's where a lot of his heat comes from.

You know you guys have told me Seth is The Man but he doesn't look like The Man. He's losing to The United States Champion and wrestling for The United States Title and not winning it. John Cena should be getting a World Title match but he isn't. Someone explain why not. What is going on in WWE?

Titles don't matter. That's been WWE's MO for years.

Nearphotison wrote:

Fans are supposed to think he doesn't deserve the title, that's where a lot of his heat comes from.

Is this heat drawing fans in? Are they gonna buy The Network for Kane's chase for The World Championship? I don't think so.

MooseNugget wrote:

Nearphotison wrote:

Fans are supposed to think he doesn't deserve the title, that's where a lot of his heat comes from.

Is this heat drawing fans in? Are they gonna buy The Network for Kane's chase for The World Championship? I don't think so.

Really? Because every casual fan I know is really excited every time they think someone is going to make Seth get his. The fact that he keeps escaping by the skin of his teeth makes them want to see it happen even more. I don't know if that will make them want to buy the network, but NXT is the real reason to buy the network anyway.

If your argument is that Seth winning more matches will bring in more viewers, I have some unfortunate news. The vast majority of wrestling fans don't pay any attention to win loss records, only nerds like us do.

I think maybe Seth should have some more wins, but in very heelish ways.

Nearphotison wrote:

If your argument is that Seth winning more matches will bring in more viewers, I have some unfortunate news. The vast majority of wrestling fans don't pay any attention to win loss records, only nerds like us do.

I guess that's why the only time Ryback ever drew was when he had the long undefeated streak

People care and pay attention to stuff like that. Seth losing all the time just makes the title look like a joke.

Sure Ric Flair was a cowardly heel but he wouldn't lose to someone like Magnum TA then challenge him for The United States Title! It's luscious!

MooseNugget wrote:

I guess that's why the only time Ryback ever drew was when he had the long undefeated streak

I would just like to point out that this is a false equivalency. An undefeated streak is a gimmick, it's completely different from how people view the wins and losses of regular superstars.

MooseNugget wrote:

People care and pay attention to stuff like that. Seth losing all the time just makes the title look like a joke.

Sure Ric Flair was a cowardly heel but he wouldn't lose to someone like Magnum TA then challenge him for The United States Title! It's luscious!

See, though, Seth isn't a "cowardly heel". He's a coward, sure, but the idea behind his character is that he's only where he is because of the Authority. He doesn't deserve the title, he's stolen it from more "deserving" champions like Lesnar and Cena. (Speaking of which, it seems like you compared Magnum TA to John Cena, which is a really odd choice, but okay. Nobody views Cena as a typical U.S. Champion level superstar.) You say him losing frequently makes the title look like a joke, but I'm pretty sure in Vince's mind the title's prestige is untouchable. I don't really know, you're the only person I've heard say anything bad about Seth's title reign.

If you really think wins and losses matter, though, the matches people remember (title matches) he mostly wins, a lot of them clean, too.

Seth's character is a long-haul booking procedure that's still in its adolescent phase. I really do think there's bigger plans for his character down the line, especially when he splits from the authority and had to prove himself all over again. I don't have a crystal ball, obviously, but how that eventual split is booked will do a lot to determine Seth's fate long-term.

I don't know what the logic is in having your WWE World Heavyweight Champion lose and lose and lose and lose. I made a joke that if ROH booked Jay Lethal like WWE books Seth Rollins than he would have lost to Bobby Fish and Stevie Richards!

I don't understand the logic in having your champion lose and so far no one is really explaining other than that it's some part of some grand master plan.

The story is that Triple H wants a champion that won't turn on him.

If Seth can't win without help, he won't turn on the help that he has.

Seth is being build as a champion who doesn't deserve to be champion. Even tho he loses a lot of RAW matches, at the end of the days those matches don't matter because he wins the matches that do count...when he defends his championship.

Man you guys like having a lame ass champion

Moose is getting worked so hard

I like Tyler Black

But you don't like Seth Rollins

look I wish he win more offend and in the most dirty cowardly ways possible. But I understand why he is being booked the way he is. As long as he wins his title matches, I can see his character really not caring about his non-title match loses.

Seth > Black

Not counting DQs, though, the only guys Seth is made to look weak against are Lesnar and Cena, who are both practically invincible. Everyone else he usually beats, even cleanly half the time. Occasionally he'll pick up a loss to a Roman Reigns or something, but even those are usually DQ or countout. I'm really not sure what the argument here is supposed to be. Seth's lame because he loses predetermined matches? What kind of mark logic is that?

Wrestling is subjective, not objective like football, baseball, and basketball. really w/l/d records don't matter when it comes to the stars. I remember during the time the rock was on top, he lost more then he won. But when he won, he won the big important matches.

Nearphotison wrote:

What kind of mark logic is that?

OH! OH! So I'm just supposed to care about losers am I?

Well maybe I'll should pop in a movie where the bad guy just gets his ass whooped throughout the entire film. Yeah that sounds entertaining.

MooseNugget wrote:

Nearphotison wrote:

What kind of mark logic is that?

OH! OH! So I'm just supposed to care about losers am I?

Well maybe I'll should pop in a movie where the bad guy just gets his ass whooped throughout the entire film. Yeah that sounds entertaining.

Except the WWE isn't a movie, it's a weekly television series. In television series, the bad guys lose all the time, but find other ways to come out on top (especially children's shows, which is what WWE is). Though, I still maintain that the majority of Seth's matches that end in pinfall or submission have him either coming out on top or his tag partner taking the fall. The only loss I can remember Seth having that felt like it made him look weak was when he tapped to Cena after Cena got his nose broken, but even the it's Cena so nobody should be surprised. He rolls through everyone but Lesnar.