To you what makes someone a good wrestler? Is it about the flips and kicks? The high spots? The ability to draw? to cut a good promo? his in ring work? what to you makes a good wrestler?

Ring work is most important.

MooseNugget wrote:

Ring work is most important.

I'd agree with that. I also don't think that there's one kind of in-ring style that's better than all the others, a good brawler is as good as a good high-flying guy is as good as a good technician.

Being good on the mic is fine, but really wrestling is about the wrestling.

I'd say a good all-rounder. I tend to enjoy superstars more how can do a little bit of everything, such as a Shawn Michaels. I like to watch a storyline unfold, so a superstar needs to talk as well as perform in that ring.

Ring work comes first, but you have to be good on the mic before you can ever be considered great.

I have to disagree. (go figure) But wrestling really isn't the most important thing about wrestling. It's about connecting with the crowds and the fans. Not saying the in ring work isn't important at all, it's very important. But if you just have that going for you, you truly won't make it far in wrestling. You need a interesting character, a interesting look, able to connect with the fans and able to tell a story. The in-ring work is like an action scene in a movie or an explosion. As awesome as it can be, if there is no build up or no story leading up to it, then what is the point? after all this is a fake sport. A form of theater

You can connect with the fans by telling a good story in the ring.

But you can't do it if you're thrown in a bunny costume or made to look like a clown.

YJ wrote:

You can connect with the fans by telling a good story in the ring.

but if you have no story leading into it then what does it matter? You have to have good build and story leading into the match which you can continue or finish the story in.

^Disagree. I watched Wrestle Kingdom without watching any of the build up, and still enjoyed all the matches. Matches can easily stand alone without any story and be as good.

Alive wrote:

YJ wrote:

You can connect with the fans by telling a good story in the ring.

but if you have no story leading into it then what does it matter? You have to have good build and story leading into the match which you can continue or finish the story in.

Well I guess you need some funny story when you make your titles garbage

true @MInk but not every match can be like that. You can have a few matches like that, but you still need story telling in the show, you still need people speaking. It can't be match, after match, after match and nothing meaningful comes out of that. It may work for something like PWG, but PWG and WWE are two completely different animals. 

In this era of the WWE, without a doubt there is no issue with in-ring work. But storylines and character development is seriously lacking.

MooseNugget wrote:

Alive wrote:

YJ wrote:

You can connect with the fans by telling a good story in the ring.

but if you have no story leading into it then what does it matter? You have to have good build and story leading into the match which you can continue or finish the story in.

Well I guess you need some funny story when you make your titles garbage

when did I talk about funny stories?

Maybe it's the fact there's almost never a decisive finish on RAW. How could you care about who wins the match when the ending is bullshit?

Alive wrote:

MooseNugget wrote:

Alive wrote:

YJ wrote:

You can connect with the fans by telling a good story in the ring.

but if you have no story leading into it then what does it matter? You have to have good build and story leading into the match which you can continue or finish the story in.

Well I guess you need some funny story when you make your titles garbage

when did I talk about funny stories?

Just me being a jerk

MooseNugget wrote:

Maybe it's the fact there's almost never a decisive finish on RAW. How could you care about who wins the match when the ending is bullshit?

Are you trying to say that I said the way WWE currently books it storylines and characters are the way to go? Because I think I have made it clear in the past that I think WWE's current story telling is most of the time utter shit because they don't follow basic story telling elements

Alive wrote:

MooseNugget wrote:

Maybe it's the fact there's almost never a decisive finish on RAW. How could you care about who wins the match when the ending is bullshit?

Are you trying to say that I said the way WWE currently books it storylines and characters are the way to go? Because I think I have made it clear in the past that I think WWE's current story telling is most of the time utter shit because they don't follow basic story telling elements

Yeah but I think you think things have to be overly complicated.

What was the story of the main event of Wrestle Kingdom 9? Okda wanted to get win back The IWGP Heavyweight Title from Tanahashi. We didn't need some side story BS that involved some girl or some company power struggle. No they didn't need to do that because the title matters to the people. And everyone was looking forward to the match because they knew it was going to be great. And this wasn't PWG or ROH. No this was Tokyo Dome with 36,000. The only event that draws a bigger crowd than that is WrestleMania.

MooseNugget wrote:

Alive wrote:

MooseNugget wrote:

Maybe it's the fact there's almost never a decisive finish on RAW. How could you care about who wins the match when the ending is bullshit?

Are you trying to say that I said the way WWE currently books it storylines and characters are the way to go? Because I think I have made it clear in the past that I think WWE's current story telling is most of the time utter shit because they don't follow basic story telling elements

Yeah but I think you think things have to be overly complicated.

What was the story of the main event of Wrestle Kingdom 9? Okda wanted to get win back The IWGP Heavyweight Title from Tanahashi. We didn't need some side story BS that involved some girl or some company power struggle. No they didn't need to do that because the title matters to the people. And everyone was looking forward to the match because they knew it was going to be great. And this wasn't PWG or ROH. No this was Tokyo Dome with 36,000. The only event that draws a bigger crowd than that is WrestleMania.

I didn't say we needed over complicated story lines. WWE has too much of that and is usually makes no sense.

Look at storylines like Daniel Bryan vs the Authority. Basic wrestling story telling 101. Best storylines of 2013-2014. It wasn't complicated, but it didn't just relay on the in-ring work. It was a simple about a guy who wasn't meant to make it big making it big and the evil higher uppers trying to keep him down.

Would Daniel Bryan's big win at WM have meant anything if it didn't have that journey going into it?

Well didn't mean very much because the guy got injured and lost all his steam

Well that wasn't his fault. That wasn't WWE's fault. Shit happens. Sucks that it happen. But you can't say that moment was just because of the wrestling. It was because of the journey, the story behind it.

Indy booking and Japan booking won't work in a company like the WWE. WWE just doesn't have the smarks watching their shit like indies and Japan. WWE has casual fanbase, whom may not like what an smark hardcore fan would like. you have to appeal to different types of fans in Main stream wrestling.

Alive wrote:

Indy booking and Japan booking won't work in a company like the WWE.

But it works for NXT?

and who watches NXT? the smarks, the indy fans.

Alive wrote:

Well that wasn't his fault. That wasn't WWE's fault. Shit happens. Sucks that it happen. But you can't say that moment was just because of the wrestling. It was because of the journey, the story behind it.

Nobody really cares about journey. More often than not the "journey" could make a guy look like a loser. See Lex Luger in WWE in the early '90s.

So you can honestly say if Daniel Bryan went on no fucking journey, won the fucking world title on Main event, that would work better?

jesus christ your logic will drive me to drinking again.

Well what was Hulk Hogan's journey to The WWE World Heavyweight Championship? Did Jack Tunney screw Hogan out of the title and make him look stupid and weak while doing? Not he won the title while he was hot.

What happen to Daniel Bryan? He won and lost the title in the same night. He couldn't win it back. He lost to the guy that lost to John Cena. Than he wins the title. Gets injured. Losses all his steam.